Is this game pay to win?

You could go like path of exile. There you can buy more storage or other utility, cosmetic armor and reskined skills

It's been awhile, I'm glad to see all the progress this project has made and seems release isn't too far off in the horizon. I'm hyped and many of you have made some really good points on the topic. Personally I'm opposed to any monthly pay-to-play fee as well as any VIP privileged status. I know people have suggested similarities from other games they play, however; I'd like to see Mad World take off in another direction. Well.. continue taking off in the unique and special path it has already set off on by using HTML5 and the stunning 2D Lovecraftian-style art design that has set it apart from all other games by also setting itself apart from those cash driven reward systems. That said, I fully support a cosmetic-heavy shop. I'd love to see and get my hands on more things in this art style; mixing, matching, and customizing. Items with stat bonuses.. well, most people have strong feelings about this and understandably so. I too am the kind of player who enjoys and thrives on putting in the time, work, thought, and effort over countless hours which is then rewarded; for a player to simply pay for advantages creates a feeling as though ones time and work was better spent elsewhere and that one would need to work excessively on top of all that just to catch up to those with deep wallets. I want this game to reward players for actually playing the game and not just paying into it, on that same note I believe others as well as I would be more than willing to pay for newly released cosmetics through micro-transactions. I'm basically suggesting that allowing for and funding further development while keeping gameplay fair can be achieved with just pushing new cosmetics, equipment skins, mounts, and, other customization options opposed to stat and advantage-based services which would upset the balance and fairness of the overall game.

You can also raise money through crowd investments. People are more willing to give some money then playing a game in which a payer go to endgame in no time while they have to farm.

Hey guys, to re-address the topic, nothing is set in stone towards our monetization scheme, but rest assured we are going to intensify our efforts to make as balanced and fair a system as possible. Our focus is on making a great game. We will be closely listening to the voice of the community and make adjustments going forward.

I would highly advise not going the route where you can buy gear with stats. And I would also highly advise not using a "pay to progress faster" model either. These games do not do well in America. Please look into Archeage and Black Desert Online, they both could have been one of the greatest games of all time, but instead they took this route where you can buy your way to the top and they justified it by saying the top gear is still obtainable after months and months of playtime. So while technically the best gear is obtainable for free, it is unrealistic to think people are going to get destroyed by card swipers for weeks on end and still continue to play. If you allow people to pay to win or pay to progress faster, this game will die in America just like every other MMO that goes this route. The best example of a game that has come out recently that is doing it RIGHT is Nexon's release of Global maplestory 2. They took away gear with stats for the Global/America release (they have gear with stats in both the Chinese and Korean versions), and they took out the pay to progress faster elements such as dungeon reset vouchers, etc. This means that each player is on the same footing, regardless of whether they choose to pay or not. The microtransactions are nearly all cosmetic, and they offer a "world chat" where you can pay a small amount to send a message that gets sent to the whole server. I have spent a couple hundred dollars in the last month just to send more world messages advertising my house for PvP and buying cosmetics that people have made.

The other reason they are doing so well is that they have gated progression so players can not top out and get to end game too quickly and lose interest. You don't want people getting to end game too fast and run out of things to do, that's a quick way to lose players. I would seriously recommend to have a major content patch with ridiculously hard content and better gear scheduled exactly 1 month after release, and be open about it! Provide a roadmap of development so we can follow along. Nexon, for as many mistakes as they have had, are finally learning and Maplestory 2 is doing incredibly well in America, which is quite shocking. 1 month after the game's release, they have MORE players than what they started with, and that is nearly unheard of. I can assure you, it is because Nexon learned from their past mistakes and because they took away the pay to win/pay to progress faster, and they gated content at the right pace. The best route to go, in my humble opinion, is purely cosmetic with an "optional" monthly subscription. Americans (like myself) are suckers for cosmetics, especially cosmetics that are unlocked via achievements or are subject to time limits. For example, there could be an armour set that is only available for purchase after you win 10,000 battlegrounds. I'm the idiot that would mindlessly grind those out just so I can buy it to show my status. Also, I would recommend doing two-week long or month long events where you have to pay real money to unlock smaller cosmetics, but at the end, if you spend enough (likely around $100), then the final prize is an awesome looking cosmetic set that you can only get for paying real money to unlock the others. For an example of this type of system, look into Smite by Hi-Rez studios. They run events where you have to pay real money to unlock certain cosmetics, then at the end, if you have spent around $100 doing the event within the time-limit, you unlock the final cosmetic suit which is usually an incredibly awesome looking character skin that will never be available again.

The subscription model is a good one, in my opinion. Something relatively cheap, $5 to $7 a month, that gives bonus experience, bonus in-game currency for killing creatures, maybe extra 5% for rare drops, things of that nature. It would be something that it is possible to play without the subscription, but it would be really really worth it to pay for the subscription.

I'm really looking forward to Mad World MMO, and I think it really could have a great following as long as you guys/gals don't make the mistake of going with a pay to win or pay to progress faster model.

Thank you for your time, and good luck bug hunting and getting the game ready for us!

@MLB Sure, Guild Wars 2 (B2P w/ Cosmetics, World of Warcraft (B2P w/ Sub), Elder Scrolls Online (B2P w/ Cosmetics + optional Sub that's totally worth the $15 a mo), FFXIV (B2P w/ Sub).

Now MMORPGS that are Pay to Win like this game sounds like it will be (and struggle to survive) RIFT, Neverwinter, BDO, DDO, LOTRO, and just about every other crap on out there.

@krm94 Thank you for the advise. Could you let us know MMORPGs that are good examples of this?

Gear with stats is pay to win and this game will die, its simple. Make it buy to play with a small ($5-$10) sub. That why your undercutting other pay to play mmorpgs but not having a cash shop even for cosmetics will attract more people than with one. If you must be F2P then only cosmetics is the only way to go.

Thank you guys. Can't give you guys a definite answer right now but this is something we will continue to look into carefully.

I can't agree more with them...

I hope that you go for the convenience route rather than selling gear directly because selling gear you have to get ingame just in order to stay competitive isn't seen as a good thing in the western market. They would prefer to buy convenience items like stat/skill reset, exp boost, premium status for exp/money/inventory bonus, more character slots, character/guild name change...

A borderline option would be selling newbie gear to help new players with very basic gear but that gear would be very weak compared to competitive gear.

Sounds like pay to win to me, there's tons of money to be made from cosmetics alone. This is why the mobile games industry is having trouble. If you decide not to go down this path I and many others would be interested, but if you stick with this path this game will be doa. Try making a thread on reddit stating this and see the response you get. I would much rather pay for a game upfront or possibly even have a small monthly fee if need be.

Hi! although nothing is set in stone at the moment, our current plan is to have gears with stats as well as cosmetics, but you will be able to get them if you invest time and effort without paying.

Our plan is to have a business model that will enable us to continue the development of the game and maintain an environment that's fair at the same time. We will need to make many adjustments to find the right balance watching closely how it affects the gameplay and community. If there's any good suggestion, feel free to let us know.